Something we can all agree on?

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ughOSU
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby ughOSU » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:13 pm

JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.

5. a user who goes to UVA subtly whines about how students from UVA get stereotyped as trolls, despite the reality that the stereotype is 100% correct.

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flyingpanda
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby flyingpanda » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:15 pm

stratocophic wrote:
nealric wrote:
I'm taking credit for popularizing T13. Spread it.


Egregious anti-GULC trolling in light of the recent Amlaw numbers. I am prepared to create a T15 category and letting Vandy in if they promise to play nice in the sandbox.

BP's never going to allow a T15, not if GTown's in it. Allowances may be made for a T14 including Vandy, but smart money says it's not happening either.

TBF, this started long before the numbers came out, as in December or January.


Yeah DF has been hating on GTown since as long as I can remember.

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TheWire
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby TheWire » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:16 pm

JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.


Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.

Disclaimer: I've been accepted by NYU but waitlisted by UVa...if I wanted to go there I would have been an ED contract away...

--theWire (hth)
Last edited by TheWire on Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mr. Matlock
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby Mr. Matlock » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:19 pm

1
Last edited by Mr. Matlock on Sun Feb 28, 2010 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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RVP11
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby RVP11 » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:21 pm

TheWire wrote:
JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.


Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.

--theWire (hth)


tl;dr

I'm somewhat bothered that you didn't have the time to write a shorter response.

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D. H2Oman
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby D. H2Oman » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:22 pm

TheWire wrote:
[strike]Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.[/strike]

UVA SUCKS!
--theWire (hth)


Agreed

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booboo
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby booboo » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:22 pm

TheWire wrote:
JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.


Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.

--theWire (hth)


Seriously?

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Nom Sawyer
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby Nom Sawyer » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:22 pm

Image

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stratocophic
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Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby stratocophic » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:24 pm

JSUVA2012 wrote:
TheWire wrote:
JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.


Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.

--theWire (hth)


tl;dr

I'm somewhat bothered that you didn't have the time to write a shorter response.

The wall of text is vaguely terrifying.

ughOSU
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 9:42 pm

Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby ughOSU » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:38 pm

UVA people troll for their school a lot on these forums. The only people who don't admit this are UVA trolls. Who cares?

showNprove
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:52 pm

Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby showNprove » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:42 pm

.
Last edited by showNprove on Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
TheWire
Posts: 480
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:24 pm

Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby TheWire » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:47 pm

showNprove wrote:
TheWire wrote:
JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.


Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.

--theWire (hth)

You forgot your disclaimer: "accepted by NYU but waitlisted by UVa."


Sorry, I actually should have added that to prevent comments such as this. I've also been waitlisted at Penn and Chiago, and will be eventually at Michigan. This is all irrelevant to observable facts about certain schools.
Surely, you can agree that I would have been accepted if I wished to troll UVA and send in an ED contract...

User avatar
im_blue
Posts: 3276
Joined: Sun Apr 12, 2009 3:53 am

Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby im_blue » Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:49 pm

showNprove wrote:
TheWire wrote:
JSUVA2012 wrote:Play-by-play:

1. OP posts some ranks that everyone really can agree on. (And nice to see. A year ago I felt alone in my belief that NMVPBDCN were peer schools.)

2. Someone posts some ridiculous rankings in a thinly veiled attempt at trolling against UVA.

3. No one from UVA disputes it or even posts in the thread.

4. Everyone har-hars about how UVA people troll for their school so much.


Forgive me for not taking to heart a rankings list, which heavily favors UVA, from an individual that tried to convince me Cornell would have better placement in LA than UCLA. Do you really think labeling schools "peers" because placement statistics may indicate that the same percentage of people from the trolling school (UVA cough cough) are receiving big law offers? It's not like UVA is dominating NYU in placement is it? Even if you want to believe that placement from UVA is equivalent to NYU (which it isn't), it's ironic how you fail to mention other characteristics of the school, such as the faculty, which would benefit NYU. You don't see anyone on these forums saying, "NYU has a better faculty than UVA, therefore you will be educated in a more competitive learning environment, therefore NYU is better than UVA." The reason you don't find morons saying those things is because people attending NYU aren't insecure about it. NYU, perhaps more so than any other school in CCN, is going to remain a t6 for a long time. USNWR ranked NYU ahead of Columbia at the 4 spot last year. When was the last time you saw UVA there? Further, the main reason that NYU doesn't get the respect it deserves here is because of TLS elitism and prestige whoring in its most blatant form. Nobody dares to question the prominence of the University of Chicago or Columbia because of the prestige of their undergrad programs. If someone tried to compare UVA to Columbia, they would get laughed out of the room. However, because NYU has less prestige, someone can take some circumstantial evidence (such as one factor in which UVA may be roughly equivalent to NYU) and use it, erroneously, to support the claim that UVA~NYU. If you go to NY and ask hiring partners how they feel about the distinction between Columbia law and NYU law, a LARGE majority of them will indicate that the quality of the two law programs is essentially the same. Why don't you find it odd to see Columbia's most favorite admirers admit that NYU is a peer? If anything, the only difference is the (partly due to elitist morons on TLS) PERCEIVED prestige of the programs (mostly by people that are NOT in law school).

You trolls are a joke. I know that nothing I could possibly say would convince someone such as JSUVA2012 to think about this in a more rational, non-biased manner. And this should be expected; after all, if someone tried to convince me that the Lakers were "peers" to other teams, I would very passionately troll against this idea. However, the fact remains...NYU and UVA are NOT peer schools. Well, actually they are. They are peers in the sense that they are part of an exclusive club that consists of the very top law programs. However, trying to say that UVA ~ NYU is ridiculous. Take a minute to think about what education entails. I'm sure that graduates of MIT or Cal tech enjoy roughly the same "placement statistics" for there graduates as Harvard does. This is because all of the top school graduates confer a sense of prestige to future employers. However, Harvard is clearly a place of higher education. So, in that sense it is not unthinkable to think that UVA may have similar overall placement prospects. But to "rank" the school similarly to NYU is going against the point of overall rankings. One factor does not override all else.

- NYU DEFINITELY has a better faculty.
- NYU most definitely has better access to the more prestigious law firms (and a rebuttle that consists of "only because it is located in NY" is complete nonsense because perhaps that is a con of UVA and a pro of NYU.) Further, the 250 placement statistics in no way indicate that these schools are accessing the same types of firms. (i.e. NYU --> possible access to top vault firms; however, that is not possible for a school that has relatively low placement in NY)
- NYU definitely is located in an area that confers more social opportunities to those individuals that are social/ want to explore a city.
- NYU will continue to be "ranked" better according to USNWR so your rankings are USELESS.

Like I said, my intention isn't to troll in favor of NYU; instead, it is to stop other people from trolling their schools. It is absurd. If you are an individual that is insecure enough to focus this intently on perceived "rankings," it is unfortunate that you have yet to realize that the only rankings that matter are USNWR. Nobody in the real world is going to say " Thank god! I just looked at TLS and saw a thread that said 'Something we can all agree on.' It's such a relief to see that EVERYONE agrees that UVA is a peer of NYU. If you don't realize the absurdity behind this (which clearly you don't) then please continue to troll your school.

I'm also not trying to pick on UVA; it really is a great school. I have a lot of respect for the program, but it just seems that TLS fosters a UVA trolling culture. Just realize that you are not changing the mind of anyone other than the school you are trolling. The people that are ultimately planning on attending that school will agree because it makes them feel better to see one of the law school powerhouses belittled by a group of 0Ls. Nobody at NYU is feeling insecure. Nobody there is thinking "Sh** UVA is placing relatively well. It can't be because they are a top 10 school or anything, they are clearly creeping up on us and ready to overtake us."

If you want to talk about UVA's peers, look up DUKE. This school is passionately disdained by TLS despite strong "placement statistics." Further, 10 out of 10 individuals that don't attend either school, and are more or less "lay" individuals, will say that Duke>UVA. But, the thing is, IT DOESN'T MATTER. UVA is much closer to Duke than NYU, stating otherwise is just highlighting your bias.

I love Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia, Chicago, NYU, Berkeley, Penn, Michigan, UVA, Duke, Cornell, and Georgetown. They are all great schools. (And yes that is clear anti-Northwestern trolling, although NW is a great school as well).

Pick your school and if you want to convince yourself that it is better than Harvard so be it. However, please choose to do that on a single thread; because nobody else cares.

BTW, I've seen how JSUVA2012 plays on TLS. He/she will come back, refute every error in my thinking process, try to belittle my argument by focusing on several moot points, and then try to pretend that he/she is impartial. Similarly, he/she may change his/her stance slightly (such as he did when he later admitted that Cornell may not have better placement than UCLA in LA). Finally, he/she will try to turn me into a bad guy by showing that I am picking on UVA trolls. Please consider the fact that I am picking only on trolls. I completely respect individuals that have a sense of pride for their school; however, having a sense of pride for UVA doesn't mean you should pick a fight with a "peer" school (NYU) which, ironically, almost everyone that matters (USNWR, faculty that choose where they want to teach, prestigious firms, etc.) would admit is better.

Ultimately, the disdain I have for this TLS thread is the title. It is complete Bullcrap and I resent the fact that false advertising such as this affects the thought process of equally ignorant 0Ls (not to say all 0Ls are ignorant but many surely are) on TLS.

--theWire (hth)

You forgot your disclaimer: "accepted by NYU but waitlisted by UVa."


Ahh, makes sense now.

keg411
Posts: 5935
Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:10 pm

Re: Something we can all agree on?

Postby keg411 » Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:38 pm

The only thing anti-trolled about Dook is the basketball team. I wouldn't say the law school is universally despised.




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