Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

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Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Vanderbilt
70
72%
Notre Dame
23
24%
Push
4
4%
 
Total votes: 97

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ArtVandelay
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Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby ArtVandelay » Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:06 pm

For Biglaw, no location preference. Ignore money/COL. Please explain your answer.

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reebtoor
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby reebtoor » Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:26 pm

Nationally, I think Notre Dame might place a little better. However, Notre Dame's main presence, in Biglaw, is in Chicago, and there is a much stronger presence of top schools in the area than in the South, where Vanderbilt is kind of the biggest show in town. If you don't care where, I think Vanderbilt in the South is better than Notre Dame in Chicago.
Last edited by reebtoor on Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ArtVandelay
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby ArtVandelay » Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:27 pm

reebtoor wrote:Nationally, I think Notre Dame might place a little better nationally. However, Notre Dame's main presence, in Biglaw, is in Chicago, and there is a much stronger presence of top schools in the area than in the South, where Vanderbilt is kind of the biggest show in town. If you don't care where, I think Vanderbilt in the South is better than Notre Dame in Chicago.


That makes sense. So you're saying for a neutral place like Boston, Notre Dame would have a slight edge?

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reebtoor
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby reebtoor » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:10 pm

I'm no expert, but I would definitely think so. Every school claims to have a strong alumni network, but Notre Dame really does. They place well nationally, although not always in Biglaw. There also seem to be a lot of people that transfer from BC or BU to ND, and vice versa.

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chadwick218
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby chadwick218 » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:23 pm

If $ is the same, attend Vandy unless you have strong ties to the Irish.

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jcunni5
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby jcunni5 » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:28 pm

vandy is better in everyway and much more national than nd, the only place where nd might be stronger is chi and ite they are not even strong there... if you want big law then vandy is the far better choice
/thread

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najumobi
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby najumobi » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:37 pm

jcunni5 wrote:vandy is better in everyway and much more national than nd, the only place where nd might be stronger is chi and ite they are not even strong there... if you want big law then vandy is the far better choice
/thread

even for federal clerkships?

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ArtVandelay
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby ArtVandelay » Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:38 pm

jcunni5 wrote:vandy is better in everyway and much more national than nd, the only place where nd might be stronger is chi and ite they are not even strong there... if you want big law then vandy is the far better choice
/thread


Mind providing any sort of stats or source?

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wadeny
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby wadeny » Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:25 am

Eh, I would go with Vandy, but neither school is probably going to give you great odds for Big Law in this economy. ND has the reputation for having an excellent alumni network, but I agree with what reebtoor said - Chicago is going to be tough (with competition from NU, UChicago, etc), while Vandy is near more secondary markets with opportunities in the South.

Also, you said money isn't a consideration, but I think you should weigh that pretty heavily here. Chances are, if you can get into Vandy, ND should be providing some $$. If that is the case, I would take the money and run.

wired
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby wired » Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:56 pm

najumobi wrote:
jcunni5 wrote:vandy is better in everyway and much more national than nd, the only place where nd might be stronger is chi and ite they are not even strong there... if you want big law then vandy is the far better choice
/thread

even for federal clerkships?


I would say especially for federal clerkships. Vandy has really good clerkship placement for its rank and even manages to break into the DC Circuit year to year. When speaking with the admissions officer, I think something like 12-15 of their students received federal clerkships. With a class their size, that is impeccable. (Well, not as much when you consider Yale and Stanford... but still, for its rank.)

flcath
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby flcath » Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:34 am

I'm in a very similar boat but for me it's not an even-money thing. I actually don't understand how it became an even-money thing for you...

Go with Vandy, though, especially if you're okay with living in the South. It's Biglaw placement has historically been significantly better, and though those stats are laughably outdated (and optimistic), there's no reason to think that ND and Vandy's placement have changed relative to one another.

The more misleading thing is portability of the degree. I feel strongly that these are the two most nationally portable degrees outside of the T14, and I think Vandy beats ND on that count as well. Raw "where do they work/take the bar" data will suggest that ND has more portability than Vandy (and like half of the T14), but this is a much better study (it should work fine for comparing ND and Vandy, but do not use it for comparing LSs of vastly disparate enrollment sizes, 'cause it has a built-in bias towards large schools) that takes into account the quality of the employment (though this too is deeply flawed: look at the NY firms vice the, say, Milwaukee firms).

Edit: I think they're a wash for landing a federal clerkship, though. ND still has phenomenal clerkship figures (better than Cornell by a wide margin), and has sustained them for long enough to suggest that it's not a fluke. Also, though SCOTUS success stories are by nature anecdotal, there is more often than not an ND grad on the high court. The only reason I say they're a wash is because I *do* feel that Vandy is a level above ND generally; I can't support that w/ data.
Last edited by flcath on Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:48 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Helmholtz
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby Helmholtz » Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:36 am

ArtVandelay wrote:For Biglaw, no location preference. Ignore money/COL. Please explain your answer.


Vanderbilt, no question. It always performs better in biglaw placement than ND.

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im_blue
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby im_blue » Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:47 am

Vanderbilt > Notre Dame for biglaw, especially with Notre Dame getting pwned in Chicago ITE.

flcath
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby flcath » Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:54 am

im_blue wrote:Vanderbilt > Notre Dame for biglaw, especially with Notre Dame getting pwned in Chicago ITE.

ND has supposedly (word of mouth) still been placing in midwestern secondary markets alright, but I'd much rather be feeding into Atlanta right now... and that has more to do with the cities than the schools.

I would take Vandy over GULC at even money, btw (and was prepared to actually do so).

I really regret not applying to UTexas, btw, which may be the best option yet...

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im_blue
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Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby im_blue » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:00 am

flcath wrote:
im_blue wrote:Vanderbilt > Notre Dame for biglaw, especially with Notre Dame getting pwned in Chicago ITE.

ND has supposedly (word of mouth) still been placing in midwestern secondary markets alright, but I'd much rather be feeding into Atlanta right now... and that has more to do with the cities than the schools.

I would take Vandy over GULC at even money, btw (and was prepared to actually do so).

I really regret not applying to UTexas, btw, which may be the best option yet...


It's not too late to apply to Texas if you still want to.

flcath
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Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:39 pm

Re: Vanderbilt vs. Notre Dame

Postby flcath » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:03 am

im_blue wrote:
flcath wrote:
im_blue wrote:Vanderbilt > Notre Dame for biglaw, especially with Notre Dame getting pwned in Chicago ITE.

ND has supposedly (word of mouth) still been placing in midwestern secondary markets alright, but I'd much rather be feeding into Atlanta right now... and that has more to do with the cities than the schools.

I would take Vandy over GULC at even money, btw (and was prepared to actually do so).

I really regret not applying to UTexas, btw, which may be the best option yet...


It's not too late to apply to Texas if you still want to.

For me it is. Might be good advice for you though.

Texas avoided ITE entirely by switching back to Confederate money in 4th-quarter 2008.




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